Candid photography is one of those tricky things. At Folsom, Pride, or do a performance/event my photo gets taken all the time, but I also expect that and dress/act accordingly. I'm even a bit sad that I never see the photos!
When you leave the house and are in public space, in the US anyway, your rights around people taking photos of you are pretty much gone, unless it's something seen as overtly sexual like upskirt shots. There's been some question about candid photography with the intent of objectifying someone without their consent, for example with TubeCrush.net, where women send photos of cute men that they take while one public transit. Women have their photos or video taken of them by creepy dudes all the time, so there's a big question about if it's bad to objectify men in this way or not (taste of their own medicine, that sort of thing). I mean, men are often not objectified generally, hence my intense desire to dress up like a construction worker with a bunch of other femmes and catcall men in suits in downtown SF. Does that make it more ok to photograph people with sexual intentions if they aren't usually objectified in that way? I don't feel comfortable saying yes, though it's something I'm running through in my brain.
That's exactly what Desi's Candid Big Butts is doing. They have a tumblr and a blogspot where they take photos of women with large derrieres and then post them, with video costing money. Oh, and despite the fact this person does this without asking the women, they watermark all their material... so you don't steal it. IRONY!
The boy sees this, and he flags the blog over on tumblr, saying "gee, guys, this seems kind of fucked up and possibly illegal". Tumblr responds thusly:
Hello,We realize this content may be very upsetting, but we also highly value freedom of expression and freedom of speech.Sometimes content posted by a blogger may be mean-spirited or upsetting but does not violate the law. In order to maintain freedom of expression, we cannot remove that material.You can and should stop viewing content from an offending blogger. If you use Tumblr, you can also Block a blogger at http://tumblr.com/block. This prevents you from seeing content from that blogger on your Dashboard and prevents that blogger from sending you messages via Tumblr.Thank you for taking the time to share your concern with us.Beth
I looked into this further and discovered objectifying OTHER parts of women is a-ok legal-wise. Feet? Totally cool! Smoking? Legal! Asses? As long as they're wearing clothes! Upskirt, though? A step too far. Good to know. Is this objectification of fat girls ok because they're fat and aren't usually seen as desirable? If I saw my ass on this site I would be pissed.That said, I've been reading about this a lot, and while you may not need a model release for fine art or editorial use, pornography is commercial use and as such requires model releases AND 2257 forms. The question is- is pornography in the eye of the beholder? Is it in the intention in which it's displayed or presented? Is it illegal, should it be illegal, or is it just in bad taste?
Also, can I just have my usual "WTF IS WITH MALE PRIVILEGE", not only that someone feels they have the right to take these images without permission, OR to sell them, but that people consume these images without giving a fuck.
::sigh::
Feel free to tell tumblr what you think here: support@tumblr.com
UPDATE:
This letter was also written to Tumblr, and we'll let you know when a response is sent:
"Dear Tumblr folks:
The Tumblr blog http://desiscandids.tumblr.com/ is in violation of US federal law 18 U.S.C. § 2257, which requires recordkeeping from producers of sexually explicit material. The user/blog in question presents "candid" photographs and video of women and teenage girls, with some material *for sale* through *your* web service, with no documentation available about the age and consent of the persons depicted.
In addition, this content is in violation, on many counts, of New York Penal Law 235, with which I hope you are familiar, given that your company is based in New York State.
Tumblr is hosting illegal content. Since you state in your terms of service that: "Use of the Site or Services to violate the security of any computer network, crack passwords or security encryption codes, transfer or store illegal material including that are deemed threatening or obscene, or engage in any kind of illegal activity is expressly prohibited," it seems obvious that this Tumblr site should be removed.
I look forward to hearing how Tumblr chooses to resolve this issue. My New York attorney, R- M-, will also be watching the matter with interest.
Thank you.
Sincerely,
Rose White"
Posts
21 comments:
Thanks for researching this. The whole thing has that air of something where, if one were to complain, the perpetrators would resort to "but it's not illegal!" which sometimes has the same tone as "but I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!"
Wow, this seems pretty sick. And in this case I mean that literally; reading the "copy" on the site (if I can use the term loosely), this guy comes off as someone who really needs psychological help for compulsive behavior.
Not that I'm qualified to diagnose that, but I'm qualified to have suspicions, and there they are.
Also, TubeCrush; weird...
I love that Tube Crush is basically an advert for Apple. Other than that, it isn't a very nice thing to do. :-/
Comment submitted, and reposted to break the links- "LOL, you don't like that site then you will definately(sic) not like (insert long list of links here) LOL. I am a big butt candid fan and think you all should get a life!!" Paul MLK
Sweet! So it's ok if someone stalks you and sells footage of you going about your day as gay pornography?
WTF? Candids aren't porn.
LMAO, Webster's dictionary defines pornography as
1. the depiction of erotic behavior (as in pictures or writing) intended to cause sexual excitement.
2. material (as books or a photograph) that depicts erotic behavior and is intended to cause sexual excitement.
3. the depiction of acts in a sensational manner so as to arouse a quick intense emotional reaction
His videos have none of that in them. LMAO. I love how somebody who has a picture of a vibrator on the front page of their blog and is an admitted "escort" (sex worker) is trying to say someone is morally wrong.LOL, STFU.
Also, what does YOUR lawyer have to do with his videos? Are you in any of them? LOL, I doubt you'd be hot enough to be n them seeing as though the only women that protest things like this are women that are hideous, fat or both (which assume you are.) Anyway, you would have NO case against him unless you were captured on his site so nice try Princess. I also love how you completely neglected to post the links to all of the other examples of people selling candids online. Are you trying to make it seem like he's the only one doing it to cause a stir? LMAO. Somebody already tried to sue the creators of bigbootycandids and the case was thrown out. Like it or not, there are MANY, MANY more blogs and sites like his. Get over it and get over yourself and get a life loser.
Paul MLK:
Candids by themselves are not porn, no- however, if they are put into a sexual context, you are required legally to have 2257 forms. All sexual content is, because if you take photos or video of someone under 18 and post it to a website for sexual gratification, you are selling child pornography. People don't like that. Do you know very much about the legality of porn..? Cause it doesn't seem like you do.
Also, it might help you to know that Big Booty Candids has a model call on their website and are therefore unlikely to be creating actual candid content, and are likely to have the 2257 documentation required (and if not would be in a lot of trouble)- http://bigbootycandids.com/modelswanted.html
Never mind that if they link to pornographic sites they will likely be classified in court as erotic material. I didn't post the links because why give them traffic?
As for the definition of what is and is not pornography, it depends somewhat on a jury's idea of if the material is designed to arouse, which these sites are. It's a friend of mine who asked her lawyer about this situation to see if there was a case- there can be if there's any concern someone on the site is under 18, and it's up to the site to prove that's not true. Please enjoy reading this: http://www.coollawyer.com/webfront/internet_law_library/articles/law_library_18usc2257_article.php
My work is about informed consent between adults. It is completely different from taking photographs of people without their consent and posted them online to arouse others. I have consented to the images on my blog- I own all the images, and if someone else took them, they get credited. I feel pretty god about my moral stance here, sugarplum, but thanks for playing.
As someone who sells sex for a living (quite successfully, mind- when was the last time someone paid several hundred an hour for your time? and where is YOUR image? Oh, right) I'm pretty secure that I am an attractive woman. Yep, I'm fat, but trying to fling that as an insult is ridiculous- I make it part of my marketing, which you'd know if you had, oh, I don't know, read my blog.
Personal insults are silly, by the way. I got insulted by Porn WikiLeaks, and they were way, way bigger than you.
It's really interesting to me that there are people who seem to take such thrill in reading the published words of others in a blog... get offended when they willingly read someone's blatant OPINION about something... and then proceed to berate the person for expressing their opinion on their blog in their own words relating to their own feelings.
As someone who has enjoyed a fair amount of time on both sides of a camera - asking permission is typically considered a MINIMUM before taking an individuals photograph (this tends to hold true for individuals over groups)... if someone wants to post something as their own work... they *should* have the models written permission to really cover their bases.
One of the biggest problems I see with the site... is that the women who are in the photographs... may very well object to having these photographs and SHOULD have EVERY right to request they are taken down. The presentation that particular website has is that these women were in public therefore they are owned. Trademarking a photograph is owning it. Trademarking without consent is like stating you own a person. Yes I did just go there and make it a case about slavery.
Feel free to bash away, but honestly it's pretty clear who could use a dose of their own medicine in terms of "getting a life".
The sad thing is that fans of these sites are hung up on their legality and bothered about their own enjoyment of them. The issue is the very real distress they can cause the innocent people who end up in them. Perhaps some of these people will feel differently when their teenage daughters backside ends up on a website on the internet and gets circulated to all their friends? there are PLENTY of sites to look at where people have consented - go there.
it seems http://desiscandids.tumblr.com/ is no longer live
Paul MLK
I am not a barrister at law nor am I a high court judge so I would not really like to comment on what the legal definition of pornography however these things are always looked at in context.
Your whole argument however plummets downward with your personal attacks on Kitty Stryker. Firstly you try to claim the moral high ground based on what you consider moral, referring to what Kitty has on her front page and her lifestyle choices. This beggars the question:- If you are so repulsed by this why are you here? I can only suggest you either got here by accident whilst researching your feline interests or more likely you are perusing the internet all on your own with thie help of a box of kleenex!
Your next personal attack sinks lower still displaying your true character and negating any comment you had, reducing any chance that your post carries any worth to zero.
Kitty is intelligent, funny, witty gorgeous and downright sexy, she is more a man than you will ever be and more a woman than you will ever have so please do us all a favour and keep your insults and valueless drivel to yourself
It would appear that Desi's tumblr has disappeared. Now if only blogspot can follow suit.
Awesome! It's great to see this having an effect. :D
LOL, This is funny. I am Desi and I laugh so hard at this. A couple of my fans sent me this link. I have been planning to delete my Tumblr account since early December so your pathetic little post had nothing to do with it seeing as though I recieved nothing from Tumblr about the site. My friend will be promoting my stuff because he has about 500 followers. And no my blogspot will not be going down anytime soon so if you don't like my stuff, don't visit the blog. Simple as that. I love how (like most internet "hard asses" screen your comments so that anytime someone responds with something that you can't refute you simply don't publish it. LOL and from what I hear you are an overweight Call girl? LMAO
And this isn't porn nor is it an invasion of privacy. In most of the videos you can't see the woman's face. Plus who appointed you web sheriff? LOL, Like one of my fans said, get a life.
P.S. there are hundreds of candid sites around the net and if they were llegal, then there wouldn't be any of them on Youtube. I mean, the women are fully clothed and you put videos of your fat cellulite bum on here and you're complaining about my content?
Hi there Desi!
Actually, you're wrong about your content and blogger's policy:
"Do not use Blogger as a way to make money on adult content. For example, don't create blogs where a significant percentage of the content is ads or links to commercial porn sites."
Due to the nature of your site and what you link to, your content would be classified as "for erotic purposes" and therefore pornography. And especially as you've posted things you define as "teen", that could go into child pornography- unless you have the 2257 records. Do you?
Again- my content is different because it is self-produced or credited and it features me or other consenting people. Period. It doesn't matter how explicit it is, it's about consent. Is that difficult for you to understand?
Candids are a touchy subject when it comes to legality, but if you are making money off of it and putting it in an adult context, that is definitely illegal. As soon as photographs of strangers are for commercial purposes, you need a model release.
:)
Knowledge is power.
Resorting to ad hominem attacks really affects one's credibility (not that the ones using them had much credibility to begin with...).
What if the people in the videos have a job (say a teacher) which is threatened by these videos because "the teacher is in porn"?
These people in this fabricated, erotic setting are not there of their free will and yet their lives could be in danger.
The content might not be pornagraphic in nature but if someone's parent accidently finds the site and just sees "wiggly porn ass" as a title and see's it looks very much like Mrs X from school then a whole shit storm is gonna be born.
It's not just about the legality, but the morality of "candid" shots. That's why the majority of commercial "candid" porn films are not. "True" Candid items are a fantasy, just as rape is a fantasy to some people, you don't just go out and rape someone.
(I hope that made sense, I am not at all endorsing rape, non consensual acts are bad, the portrayal of non consesual acts in a consensual setting is not is what I am trying to say)
Oh, btw, commenters supporting Desi's "right" to eroticize and sell images of women (some perhaps underage) without their consent? I noticed you all write the same way, in the same voice, and unless you're saying something to add to the conversation or offer something new, I won't bother publishing you.
HAHA, even if you do get it removed (which it likely won't), I have just exported the blog and I can make a new one which you will not have the address to. I can use my current places of promotion to direct my fans there. LMAO
So what exactly wll you accomplish? LMAO
Seriously, get a life.
I would also love to thank my supporters. HAHA
and like another fan just pointed out on my blog, some of your pages contain images of actual porn (full frontal male nudity and sexual acts, I'm pretty sure your blog is in violation of Blogger guidelines. Shame if it got flagged as well. I have posted the link and advised my fans to flag your (actually pornographic) blog as well.
Please refer to this:
"Adult Content: We do allow adult content on Blogger, including images or videos that contain nudity or sexual activity. But, please mark your blog as 'adult' in your Blogger settings. Otherwise, we may put it behind a 'mature content' interstitial.
There are some exceptions to our adult content policy:
Do not use Blogger as a way to make money on adult content. For example, don't create blogs where a significant percentage of the content is ads or links to commercial porn sites.
No incest or bestiality content: We do not allow image, video or text content that depicts or encourages incest or bestiality."
-http://www.blogger.com/content.g
Good luck with that though! And as long as you're off blogger and tumblr, and not on, say, wordpress, then I'll leave you to it til I hear about you again.
OMG, this is crazy!! I actually know this guy.
This guy Craig (“Desi”s real name) lives in my apartment complex right down the hall from me. I know it is him because we were talking one day (about women) and he asked if I was a butt man and told me to check out his blog and gave me the link to his site Desi’s Candids. Anyway, a couple of days ago I noticed a bunch of cops in the hallway and I decided to see what was happening. I was SERIOUSLY freaking out because at first I thought someone had died or something. I asked one of the cops what was up and apparently Craig got caught following and filming some women at the mall down the road, was arrested and was being detained. I guess that they were there on a search warrant because they were carrying some things out of his apartment (including both of his computers.) From the looks and sound of it he is in some very hot water since we haven’t seen him in a while. As soon as I heard about it I went to his site to see what kind of stuff he was doing. I found a link to this post in one of his posts. I have refrained from using his full name for legal purposes but I don’t think he will be surfing the web anytime soon.
Also, I would like to apologize to any gay males or females that took any offense to the stupid crap that he said on his blog. As a heterosexual male even I was offended by the stuff that he posted on his site. However, I did find it funny that he was making fun of you for being overweight when not only does he like hefty women but, get this, he is overweight himself.
Please pardon my rambling but this is insane. I can keep you all posted on any further information about this clown if you want. I personally can’t stand the guy after I caught him trying to break into a neighbor’s place. In fact, I personally hope he stays in jail for a long time so that he can have access to all the butts he desires (albeit of the male variety) ;P
Amazing!! What a douchebag supreme! He really couldn't fathom the consent thing at all until the cops came to explain it. Truly outstanding idiocy.
And calling women fat as an insult is so over. Hell I'm fat and that's one of the many feminine wiles I used to lure my husband. I'm fat in part because my father was seduced by my fat mother. He only likes big women, too. My best friend only dates fat women because they are the only beauties that give her strap-on a hard on. And here we see again Desi throwing all that sublimated desire around calling you fat probably while he popped a sad chubby looking at your pics. Crazier still because he had a site featuring zoftig ladies and his "fan" (if indeed that was a different person writing in) clearly likes large women if he liked the offending candids site also.
Hopefully one day people will feel confident enough to be honest about what they truly desire.
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